[ilio]

i think u need to reevaluate the root of the problem rather than the problem or this will happen again.

I think myllenoris wasn't going to grow after the war. its ic grew sort of shoddy/muddled (mainly due to lack of teraphim rebirths, 220 rpl) and it sat in the spotlight for an entire month while the war was on. a race of prideful elfs that were made strong verbwise to reflect such but at the same time they never really had the chance to grow and shine by themselves which is a shame.

not aimed to call any settlement out in particular but like everyone else said, having looser morals ic / no identity makes the settlements similar. it makes the game unappealing to new players imo.

the osrona/myllenoris conflict could of been rly cool if it was just them 2. a broken alliance after numerous tense scenes between their leaders behind closed doors.

but then theria threw its hand in .. and illburg joined. to me it felt like everyone dogpilled cos they knew they would win.
im sure there was more reason to them joining but it didnt necessarily feel like that from our side.

in truth the war and fallout from it is good rp and i personally enjoyed it. but the resulting game state i take responsibility for.
i didn't particularly think nysea would grow so fast nor did I want it to become more than it originally was, partially why i didn't make any SoEs.

my suggestion is the admins should make an ooc limit of factions (2v2s max) on wars unless there is a ic reason and narrative for it, otherwise i see this happening again. alexander was super unlikeable tho, meant to be brash and direct even if it led to his downfall, and i did write him that way so perhaps this was a rare thing. either way i dont care that osrona lost tbh. it was a p.good story. 

to me, most factions feel like their characters are sort of best friends between them. like the one city peace thing that was around pre-timeskip, where everyone sort of jumps around.

imo the theme from the start of the wipe is sort of lost.

[rea]

but then theria threw its hand in .. and illburg joined.. lol. its like everyone dogpilled cos they knew they would win OOCLY.

this is really the take


i understand that it is a biased take because i was on the side everyone dogpilled, but reading the SoE's from that time is like ... pretty pathetic in how everyone jumped on "We'll be joinin' the fight!" against someone who was already the losing fight, and was apparently the worse of two evils for ... not abdicating when told 'abandon your people or die', and then got told he was abandoning his people for not abandoning his people. 

obviously that goes into ";3 take it to ic!!!!!!!!!!!!" feelings which i 1. did 2. cant anymore, but having as many settlements as we did with such small populations really spread the butter thin on this meat and made the story weaker than it deserved to be

[Theori]

Lot of words

The first thing Myllenoris did after the reception was look for allies. Osrona was a monolith of IC power with a lot of decently strong fighters, so that was logical from an IC standpoint. It had also been recently attacking Theria -Myllenoris v Osrona started less than a year after Myl+Os v Theria+Ilburg. The argument we used was pretty simple. "If Osrona will attack its own ally, its going to come for you next. Join us and beat Osrona together, or lose individually." I'm obviously very biased regarding that war, but insinuating OOC motivations when it made perfect IC sense isn't really something I'm happy to see. It'd be like me saying the only reason Alexander started the conflict in the reception was because you, Ilio, OOCly knew there was an overwhelming chance of victory for Osrona. I'm still kinda shocked that Asta and Regulus got out of there -and lets be honest, Regulus didn't 'betray the purpose of the marriage', he got forced to choose Asta or act like a full on psychopath and break the bond. 

When a settlement has garnered bad blood with every other settlement by warring them, of course they're gonna team up to fight them. Myllenoris' post war plans, then actions, were based around player characters -Regulus fought very hard to stop Asta conquering Osrona, and Finley was never really the type to conquer. You can wish things were different, but I don't really think its fair to dictate what you think would be 'better' for other people's characters to do based on your own views. ICly sure, but not OOCly. 

Now, regarding this: 'having loose morals ic / no beliefs/ not following lore /coalition peace pact / friendship prevails mentality makes ur settlement boring to be in.' I don't necessarily disagree. Lore is there for a reason, and you should ideally stick to your guns. I'm not perfect when it comes to that, I'll admit as much. But I also think forcing endless war isn't a solution either. The Coalition was fine as a springboard for the Barsburg arc, but then things happened and it was delayed(or set aside?) in favour of something else. Even with the Coalition there was still things going on; ie. Theria's leadership changes, Myllenoris going into the Vale, Osrona rebuilding, etc. Could there be more going on? Probably. I think Nysea's existence might have exacerbated things with a bunch of rebirths going there instead of to the people who won the war, but not really anything that can be done about that now.

As a final thing, I'll say this: despite being on the opposite side of the war, I've had no OOC problem with you. But saying things like this: 'assumed other people would treat ic with the respect it deserved' with the implication then being they didn't comes across as really quite rude. People know how to play their characters, its not fair to dictate the way things go as wrong because it doesn't fit your ideal world. That may not be what you meant, but its really how it came across to me.

[ilio]

Lot of words

The first thing Myllenoris did after the reception was look for allies. Osrona was a monolith of IC power with a lot of decently strong fighters, so that was logical from an IC standpoint. It had also been recently attacking Theria -Myllenoris v Osrona started less than a year after Myl+Os v Theria+Ilburg. The argument we used was pretty simple. "If Osrona will attack its own ally, its going to come for you next. Join us and beat Osrona together, or lose individually." I'm obviously very biased regarding that war, but insinuating OOC motivations when it made perfect IC sense isn't really something I'm happy to see. It'd be like me saying the only reason Alexander started the conflict in the reception was because you, Ilio, OOCly knew there was an overwhelming chance of victory for Osrona. I'm still kinda shocked that Asta and Regulus got out of there -and lets be honest, Regulus didn't 'betray the purpose of the marriage', he got forced to choose Asta or act like a full on psychopath and break the bond. 

When a settlement has garnered bad blood with every other settlement by warring them, of course they're gonna team up to fight them. Myllenoris' post war plans, then actions, were based around player characters -Regulus fought very hard to stop Asta conquering Osrona, and Finley was never really the type to conquer. You can wish things were different, but I don't really think its fair to dictate what you think would be 'better' for other people's characters to do based on your own views. ICly sure, but not OOCly. 

Now, regarding this: 'having loose morals ic / no beliefs/ not following lore /coalition peace pact / friendship prevails mentality makes ur settlement boring to be in.' I don't necessarily disagree. Lore is there for a reason, and you should ideally stick to your guns. I'm not perfect when it comes to that, I'll admit as much. But I also think forcing endless war isn't a solution either. The Coalition was fine as a springboard for the Barsburg arc, but then things happened and it was delayed(or set aside?) in favour of something else. Even with the Coalition there was still things going on; ie. Theria's leadership changes, Myllenoris going into the Vale, Osrona rebuilding, etc. Could there be more going on? Probably. I think Nysea's existence might have exacerbated things with a bunch of rebirths going there instead of to the people who won the war, but not really anything that can be done about that now.

As a final thing, I'll say this: despite being on the opposite side of the war, I've had no OOC problem with you. But saying things like this: 'assumed other people would treat ic with the respect it deserved' with the implication then being they didn't comes across as really quite rude. People know how to play their characters, its not fair to dictate the way things go as wrong because it doesn't fit your ideal world. That may not be what you meant, but its really how it came across to me.

i have nothing against myllenoris for requesting to make allies. it made sense with regulus leading it and asta. more the other settlements not having pride to not accept. i also rly liked the ic of asta and alexander that came about through a bunch of scenes u were and werent a part of. hence i thought the war would be cool and it came about ic. as i said tho, mistakes were made in how it was conveyed.

u are right on the rude part, and i do apologize for that. it did insinuate such. so ill edit that out but it wasnt quite what i intended. to a degree tho i think the ic could have been handled better on all sides.

[Theori]

Lot of words

more words

i have nothing against myllenoris for requesting to make allies. it made sense with regulus leading it and asta. more the other settlements not having pride to not accept. i also rly liked the ic of asta and alexander that came about through a bunch of scenes u were and werent a part of. hence i thought the war would be cool. as i said tho, i made mistakes.

u are right on the rude part, and i do apologize for that. it did insinuate such. so ill edit that out but it wasnt quite what i intended. to a degree tho i think the ic could have been handled better on all sides.

We cool, man. I get what you're trying to get across, just think it maybe could have been said a little better (much like my own post!)

[Chance]

i think you're either purposely ignoring or forgetting important details, such as individual character motivations and the chain of events. i'm not going to go over every point but the war begun with osrona declaring that they'd conquer theria/slay garljing (following the myll/ilburg stuff), and it continued to escalate from there. the first 2v1 was myll/osrona vs theria, and you personally worked to make peace with ilburg along with myll, to avoid a 2v2... despite your original terms being 'theria needs to break up with ilburg'. then occultists, then witches

...which is fine, but don't act like you're on some kind of pedestal when you clearly tried your best to win (ICly). which is also okay?

the mistake osrona probably made was pulling out before it was all over, and initiating a ceasefire that to many seemed somewhat random. you had your opportunity to remove theria from the picture and lost it, despite clearly trying very hard to do so to begin with by working with every single faction in the game

so, characters and nations can react to circumstance. if theria wants to form a temporary alliance with myllenoris because they had been speaking behind the scenes before the war even begun-- while the newly anointed alexander was purposely ignoring theria's calls-- that's okay, and it's what happened. there's an element of politics to the game and to say that "no war should ever be more than a 1v1" is a poor solution to imo something that wasn't even really a problem, because the war was organic and had the kinds of twists and turns that didn't 'hurt' the story

idk, a lot of what you're saying just seems ignorant or so off the ball to me that it's difficult to address. i'd say you need to reevaluate the story and what occurred before making those kinds of claims. what you're suggesting would, if anything, just make things really boring and awkward. and i'm not implying that you played your character badly at all, or did anything wrong OOCly. just that your complaints are somewhat invalid and far from the source of the problem - which is moreso that keeping an intense tempo like that going indefinitely isn't possible as time rolls on

[ilio]

i think you're either purposely ignoring or forgetting important details, such as individual character motivations and the chain of events. i'm not going to go over every point but the war begun with osrona declaring that they'd conquer theria/slay garljing, and it continued to escalate from there. the first 2v1 was myll/osrona vs theria, and you personally worked to make peace with ilburg along with myll, to avoid a 2v2... despite your original terms being 'theria needs to break up with ilburg'. then occultists, then witches

...which is fine, but don't act like you're on some kind of pedestal when you clearly tried your best to win (ICly). which is also okay?

the mistake osrona probably made was pulling out before it was all over, and initiating a ceasefire that to many seemed somewhat random. you had your opportunity to remove theria from the picture and lost it, despite clearly trying very hard to do so to begin with by working with every single faction in the game

so, characters and nations can react to circumstance. if theria wants to form a temporary alliance with myllenoris because they had been speaking behind the scenes before the war even begun-- while the newly anointed alexander was purposely ignoring theria's calls-- that's okay, and it's what happened. there's an element of politics to the game and to say that "no war should ever be more than a 1v1" is a poor solution to imo

idk a lot of what you're saying just seems ignorant or so off the ball to me that it's difficult to address. i'd say you need to reevaluate the story and what occurred before making those kinds of claims

hmmm. u are right. ill edit my post down cos it does come off across as belligerent and ignorant/grandstanding. detracting from the main intent. and yes, the ic was muddled, im not oblivious to such but the start of the war was made by serea not alexander and the war lasted a long time oocly, so ic changed fast every day, hence where confusion lied. as soon as the war was waged by serea, a raid thread should have been put up. instead there was a delay, several radiant promotions, etc.

it did pinball from terms, potential peace with theria after the bridge to removing the occultists/witches because they owned up to that ic. also the first 2v1 was more a 2v2 if I remember right, since ilburg matched up with Theria.

but i wasnt aware the backseat dealings of theria/myllenoris.

in the end, looking at it openly with what u said. i can see how things developed naturally/make more sense. but as i said my working with the other factions in game, was a mistake imo.

im also not rly saying this because im mad/bothered that osrona lost to 4 factions or anything. the ic of the story was cool, as is the ending. and its fair that characters can respond to such and have their own motivations, much like mine did. in the end my point is i think that cities should be encouraged to be more independent. but i can see the merit of ic politics as u said.

edit: oh saw ur addition. yh that makes sense and i do agree. the game obviously cant go 100% all the time.

[Eddie]

Even as someone who's currently playing a Myllenoris PC, I think the place should be eaten by the Vale/conquered by Barsburg/somehow sacked. Nuking Theria wouldn't do a whole lot to the world as a whole other than Barsburg having a mountain fortress. Losing Myllenoris would provide much more interesting roleplay, like Sanguine said:

If some place needs to be nuked by Barsburg to shake things up, this is perfect. The culture of the elves is innately prideful, so losing their home would be interesting IC in itself.

[Gunner]

Even as someone who's currently playing a Myllenoris PC, I think the place should be eaten by the Vale/conquered by Barsburg/somehow sacked. Nuking Theria wouldn't do a whole lot to the world as a whole other than Barsburg having a mountain fortress. Losing Myllenoris would provide much more interesting roleplay, like Sanguine said:

If some place needs to be nuked by Barsburg to shake things up, this is perfect. The culture of the elves is innately prideful, so losing their home would be interesting IC in itself.

Yeah Myll hasnt really had to deal with people marching on them directly, at least not to the extent of the others. But I dont think nuking a place is exactly the best idea per say unless its really not being populated like Ilsburg or something.

Also since no one else is saying it, Alabastre and Theria both have pretty decent sized guilds based out of them. The Hunters Lodge and the Dragon Tooth Guild. Everyone going around saying theres no one in these places is a bit shit to the people that are actively rping around those areas, but just havent been pushing some kind of world altering plot.

A large part of Theria's problem is that the past leadership and a lot of the mainstays were just outright killed or had to leave the city because of their loyalties. And sure it could make good IC as revenge fuel, but theres only so many times you can watch other people slam into a brick wall before deciding that you dont want to risk that too. For people with non-combat focused characters whats it really supposed to do? Say what you want about the leaders afking at times, they at least were around and encouraging plot for everyone in the city while they were there. The whole barsburg thing is cool but I know there are a lot of people that left Theria because they felt their IC was just shit on to push an event chain they had no real stake in. It might have made sense for people that were in the loop or whatever higher up talks there were, but to everyone else it was pretty out of nowhere.

[Chance]

Theria: Move it down to the base of the mountain, tidy the excess up a little. (Milly is currently doing this)
Ilburg: Return it back to what it was, a small bandit hideout in the desert. Add a few buildings / towers spread across the desert. The desert should get a few exclusive spawns (rope root + fire crystal NPCs)
Alabastre: NPC, remove from map. Could return in the future.
Myllenoris: A natural land bridge connecting the south to the north. The cave connect is too easy for a newbie to miss, and the south feels isolated from the north as is.
Osrona: It needs to be made smaller, but this is such a massive project that it feels bad to ask someone to take it on, though it's necessary. Right now Osrona has both the benefit of being in the centre of the map, and the most attractive lore/background to the average player.

Overworld: Add some buildings away from cities. Large hideouts in the caves  (like Theria has in the entrance cavern), cottages, towers. These should be fairly spacious with a heavy up front cost (3-5k) and be safe houses for characters who avoid cities.


& I'll likely return the spawnpoint options to just being Myll/Osrona/Theria.