The GCDE stun thread

[Sanguine415]

Just make them all on the GCD so I can apply mud and watch them miss their combos.

It's about time we made mud only slow.

[BLOX]

Just make them all on the GCD so I can apply mud and watch them miss their combos.

It's about time we made mud only slow.

cry about it lol throws dirt at you

[Teemo]

Why nerf Pyro and Tesla but not Holy Stun / Water Whip and Beams?

This doesn't fix the issue at all, people are going to do the same shit with different spells. Nerf them all

[Chance]

Why nerf Pyro and Tesla but not Holy Stun / Water Whip and Beams?

This doesn't fix the issue at all, people are going to do the same shit with different spells. Nerf them all

Specifically Pyroclasm is surrounded by highly attractive combo options as a Basic Spell, although the 'lesser evils' will be addressed if they are truly overpowered. 

So far this has not been the case. Water Whip is a 20 spell point investment if you intend to only dip, and Sanctify is an intermediate ability. Might change in the future though, just easier to start with the obvious imbalance.

[DanteriusAvius]

Seriously thank you for the change. I remain skeptical on Sanctified in particular, but seeing how it plays out makes sense.

[Teemo]

Why nerf Pyro and Tesla but not Holy Stun / Water Whip and Beams?

This doesn't fix the issue at all, people are going to do the same shit with different spells. Nerf them all

Specifically Pyroclasm is surrounded by highly attractive combo options as a Basic Spell, although the 'lesser evils' will be addressed if they are truly overpowered. 

So far this has not been the case. Water Whip is a 20 spell point investment if you intend to only dip, and Sanctify is an intermediate ability. Might change in the future though, just easier to start with the obvious imbalance.

All three of these trees have highly attractive combo options. Ether has Lightspeed, two beams, and a billion follows up for those beams. Water is similar without the Lightspeed.

The obvious imbalance is that all of them are imbalanced

[TheHopscotch]

Shut up Teemo

[Kiha]

holyflash is shit compared to pyroclasm even post-charge, the range feels smaller than the actual graphic fx

[TheHopscotch]

ok time for the real post

There will doubtless be a spell balance change coming with THE UPDATE™

However, you don't want to just break the kneecaps of every stun as the game would, again; Become very same-y. You'd see no innovation as people stack hard in immunities or root combos with little/no in-between. Optimally you went every build/tree to have its own flavor and nuances which make it attractive to a certain playstyle or roleplay trope as opposed to just comparing spells to one another each and every time. (Apples to oranges.)

While stuns do seem to be the largest offender of crazy one-off builds; the whole point of them is to be a very brief thing which allows you to quickly achieve an otherwise difficult to land spell. (Beams, etc.) The best solution as stated above without completely shifting the state of the game would probably be;

Place water whip behind an intermediate slot and bring a new spell in to replace it. (Soon?) Wanting a higher investment on stuns which start off your combo isn't necessarily a bad change to the health of the game + the power of whip spells have generally been above average ever since they were changed to be made easier to hit.

As Chance stated, the holy stun is an intermediate and doesn't seem to be a massive offender - As it requires both investment and the need to get close to your opponent.

The LARGEST offender by far has always been pyroclasm as it was a relatively cheap / low cost stun which could be slapped into a lot of builds while achieving powerful spells alongside it. (Bang - As well as fire access, etc.) Providing constructive ideas / concepts to handle stuns in a better way is naturally way more important, in a way that doesn't have every single spell in the game function the exact same as one another. (Thank you to everyone who has been doing so!)

[Lammy]

I agree with making stuns intermediate. The more investment that you need to achieve a stun / root would reduce the multiple situations where you only lose because they have Lightspeed Pyroclasm/ Water Whip Energy Beam/ Cosmic Beam / Water Beam / Sea Dragon / Occult - Holy Cannon.

And with more light spells coming along, we could buff lightspeed and slap on the public master tag with ease.